Hopefully the senate will reject, pray it does...

bend over here it comes

Just for reading info as the vote happened during us playing and I did scream the Republican that voted yes was the new guy from Louisiana, here's more info of him:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Cao

It's particularly strange to see him vote yes, I remember a few days ago watching [CSPAN] mainly republicans partake in round robin 1 minute speeches in the house on the topic and he followed in line with his colleagues blasting the bill on its costs and the violation of Laissez-faire.

I have no two cents on the situation.

Asian hosties deserve to be shot.

That dude is being charged with all kinds of shit, he shouldn't have been allowed to vote. He's a waste of F*CKIN space.

So what you are saying is that "free" healthcare is an issue that u dont
want to pass through the senate ?

Imo, and this is based on my limited knowledge of the US government,
there should be "free" healthcare in America, there should also be work programs
that works in Life aswell as on paper, but most of all you need to redo alot of
your government.. Seems like your senators and congressmen fight for power
and not for the people, if i am way off here please enlighten me :)

A couple of ideas that pop into mind how you can afford "free" healthcare
without raping the middle class, start work camps for prisoners might help pay for theire jail time.
Work programs taking ppl without a job to do necessary and easy jobs like picking up garbage,
that way atleast theyre doing something that helps the community.

Edit : also get rid of the ppl on deathrow, either kill them or put them to use, that will save
alot of tax dollars aswell..

YEA!!! I might have a gov't job sooner than I thought!1

This.

Help me Obi Wan Kanobi, your my only hope

I love Loke.

Loke, give up the arguement! You and I are from different systems with different ideals so the way the U.S. does things are very foriegn to us and vice versa with our systems. Socialized healthcare can never work in the U.S. unless they learn to divert resources from other parts of there large spending to offset the healthcare costs so that the people it's intended to help don't have to pay for it. The rest of you guys have to remember that the U.S. is the only country of the industrialized world not to have a free healthcare system, so to us non-Americans it does not make sense.

Yeah i understand that, this is just my personal view not how it needs to be done
and also im not after an argument im just saying that this is my view and then people
can put forward theire views, who knows i might learn alot from this :)

Holy Shit Norwegan! I love you.
Just wow.

Essentially, if this law comes into effect, they're going to force us to take the insurance whether we want it or not. Also, it isn't free by any means.

It's like they force you to have car insurance even though I've been accident free for 20 years. On average, I've paid close to 100 bucks a month for insurance - That's around $24,000 that I've been forced to pay out when I've never made one claim. Not one.

Over the last 20 years, I've also only been to the doctor around 5 times. Twice I was insured and had my right eye taken out and my ass worked on (don't ask, lulz), one other time was for strep throat. Another times were to get my balls checked and the last time was just recently, the dentist, to get a tooth pulled. So, I've paid around $600 dollars for healthcare in the last 20 years.

Now they're going to tax us to pay for this new health care pool. Since it's a tax, it'll be a percentage of my income. At a 5% tax, that could be somewhere around $6,000 a year that I'm forced to pay. A year ago, it would have been double that. Four years ago, it would have been closer to $30,000! I'm going to have to pay that whether I need it or not.

Granted, I may need it someday. I may need it tomorrow or ten years from now, you never know. But it should be my choice whether I want to pay it or not, not the government. Constitutionally, it's none of their F*CKING business whether I'm covered or not.

Also, compounded onto that, the man that has been the main lobby guy for pushing this through is Andy Stern, who is president of the Service Employees International Union. This union is directly tied to ACORN and this dude has been tied to communism for years. He was recently quoted saying the following things: "We are building a global organization." and "Workers of the world unite, it's not just a slogan anymore, it's a way we're going to have to do our work." also "We took names, we watched how they voted, we know where they live." also "There are opportunities in America to share better in the wealth, to rebalance the power and unions and governments are part of the solution." also "We're trying to use the power of persuasion. If that doesn't work, we're gonna use the persuasion of power because there are governments and there are opportunities to change laws that affect these companies."

This guy wants communism in the USA, no, do not want. He has the ear of our government. Now, he's ALSO the guy that helped write this health care bill.

I also work in health care, so does my wife. The impact that this bill would have on the pay that I receive is going to be ridiculous. They're going to have to cut our pay to make this work. Not only that, they're going to have to increase the work load. Why have a housekeeping department when the nurses can go and clean up after the patient leaves? Why have a phlebotomist when the nurse can draw the blood? Why have a laundry department when the nurse can wash and dry clothes? Why have a respiratory department when nurses can administer breathing treatments? Hell, why have a dietary department when the nurses can heat up food in the microwave? In the end, we're going to get paid less to do more.

To me, it's not about the health care, it's about them taking away my right to choose and forcing me to do something I do not want to do. It's about government control, it limits my rights and freedoms and the choices I choose to make. If they can do that, what next? Do they tell me what I can or cannot drink or eat? Tell me that I can't smoke? Tell me I can't engage in risky behavior like riding the dunes in a dune buggy or bungee jumping? How about snowboarding? Skateboarding? What if they decide that I shouldn't be on the computer for more than 4 hours a day because they don't want to take care of the potential carpal tunnel syndrome that I could get? This all seems a bit extreme, but if they take control of the healthcare, they have the potential to take over other areas of our life because it's directly related to the cost of the healthcare I may receive in the future.

People in the USA need to wake up and look at the facts. We're heading down the wrong track, this train is headed towards more loss of our constitutional rights and I don't want to be on it.

Amen Coach

I disagree.

I agree with the Disagree of the Disagree

Coach I understand your concern, and maybe you are right, this is something
that we have tried and it works here atleast, and i know there's nothing like a free lunch.
Allthough Healthcare in Norway is "free" we still pay something, like i pay 20 $ everytime i got to
the doctor and the government pays the rest. Now i'm not saying that everyone should do like
we do here in Norway, but maybe you can put it so that people can get the government to pay
some of the treatment if the family pays a minimum price.

And also the Government isnt saying you can't get insurance, but more in the line of
you are not supposed to need it, and you shouldn't pay more in taxes for it, i don't know how much
you pay in taxes but i pay about 36 % .

I mean that you as the working man in America shouldn't notice if they change it, but that means they have
to look over theire budget closely and start making a plan that last longer than two or four years.
Another thing, do you guys pay a toll to use the roads in your country ?

For me my government is doing a lot of things to limit the chances i have to be left with nothing if
i get into an accident at work , but we all got insurance through work, or through our union.

All i'm saying is that there are probably millions of American citizens that need this, and if your government
can find a method of doing this without dumping it on the middle class i would say that is a solution worth
testing, and also there should be more work regulations in form of workload and such, but that's another chapter.

You are correct Loke. If there was a solution that didn't dump the burden on the middle class, it might work. However, we're taking it on the middle, lower, and upper class. Also, everyone that can afford to carry insurance will be required to carry insurance so it will provide more premiums to cover the poor.

I know there's a way to make affordable (or even "free") healthcare available to every American citizen, I'm 100% sure our government will not do a proper job of it the first time around.

Your government will F*CK up once, twice, maybe three times before even getting it remotely right, Im sure my government fucked up ten times before they got the system we have now. And I pay for pretty much nothing..lol in fact on a yearly basis (not including taxes taken from each cheque) the government pays me, in rebates just for going to school lol.. Our health care is about the same as loke, although we don't pay jack shit unless its JUST for a doctors note or some physical for your drivers license etc.

Hell unless something happens I even get free surgery in 4 months which is probably worth 10k in the U.S. maybe more. I say free losely of course because I knwo it comes out of hte governmental fund which is from taxes.

The Paranoia you guys feel on a general level about socialization of anything is normal lol if this goes through and more changse are made down the road (and they work well) you'll all sit back and laugh at how you acted now