I think its funny how people are calling other people morons and knowing nothing about guns when they're trying to justify guns as a defense to home burglary. A majority of burglaries occur during the day when people are out of the house, so as stated having a gun is little of no use there. As well most burglars are simply drug addicts trying to score some cash for a quick fix, not armored assailants requiring you to have a god damn sawed off showgun or a rifle.

I could probably scare off as many burglars with a realistic looking air soft gun. The thought that you need firearms to protect your house from burglars is a hilarious notion considering most home firearm injuries are self-inflicted and not in firefights with burglars. Its been proven you're putting yourself and your home in more danger by having a firearm in it. I'd honestly rather lose some menial possessions then live the rest of my life knowing I ended someone else's who was strung out on drugs and in a bad place. And unless you live in a few select states you're more likely to end up the recipient of civil and criminal complications as most states do not allow you to simply shoot a burglar without sufficient evidence that you/your familys life is in immediate danger. If someone breaks into your house with a screw driver and you shoot them in the chest with a rifle or a shotgun or even a handgun and cause severe injuries let alone kill them, you're not protected under any laws of self-defense or defense of home in most circumstances (exceptions being if the burglars are armed or commit a violent assault/escalate the burglary to a robbery). And considering a large majority of burglars do NOT carry life-threatening weapons, it's kind of ludicrous


TLDR?: If you wanna own firearms more power to you but don't go and call people idiots for thinking (knowing) that they cause more problems than they fix when it comes to ''home defense'' and suggesting alternate methods that are proven to deter more property crime than simply owning a gun.

Here's the bottom line:

- Gun ownership is not for everybody.
- Guns can be extremely dangerous if you don't know what you're doing. This is why I ALWAYS suggest new gun owners or potential future gun owners take a class of some sort and get educated on gun safety and proper gun handling techniques.
- You are at an elevated risk of self-inflicted injury/suicide with a gun in the house. If you follow the 4 rules of gun safety and keep your shit locked up so nobody can get to it without your direct supervision, you can negate the risk of self-inflicted injury. Suicide is a lazy-man's crime, so suicidal individuals with access to firearms are more likely to be successful than those without. If you suffer from depression or another mental illness, buy pepper spray or a taser to defend yourself to help mitigate that risk.
- Rifles, handguns, and shotguns all have their pros and cons when it comes to self/home-defense. If you're serious about getting a gun, do the research and get what feels right to you.
- Do NOT brandish something that looks like a gun but isn't deadly like a gun (a gun with blanks, an airsoft/bb gun, etc) to someone who appears to be a threat. They could have a gun, and when they pull it out, you'll be completely fucked.
- If someone DOES break into your house and you arm yourself, do not kill anyone to protect property. Property can be replaced. Only shoot a home-invader if your life is in immediate danger. You can buy another xbox, but you can't buy someone else a new life. People change, and killing someone for stealing shit when they have no intention of harming you is wrong, and it will put on you a weight you'll struggle with for the rest of your life.
- Not every gun thread has to be a gun politics thread. It makes gun owners AND anti-gunners look stupid, and I'm tired of it. Agree to disagree and coexist.

i agree on all but one thing how does one know what an intruders intentions are or what they are capable of ?inside a home a intruder can be on top of you in a millisecond . i have a half a dozen signs saying things like no warning shots will be fired and a piece of diamond plate with about 700 bullet holes.its clear that the security of my home and family very serious i have been trained all my life to assume some one who enters your home against your will is a deadly threat and hesitation will get you killed and or your family in harms way.but thats just me if you guys want to ask the masked man in your home what his intentions are or point a cap gun at him have at it but it goes against all training i know of.

So im kind of tired of words being put in my mouth so Ive finally decided to comment back.

I have never once said anything negative about him owning/purchasing/wanting a gun. All I suggested was that if he is buying a gun for home protection and is not prepared to end someones life and have that weight on his shoulders for the rest of his life, to use blanks because the gun is already on order. Simple as that. If you aren't prepared to pull the trigger with real bullets and end the life of another human being, no matter how much of a lowlife they may be, a gun probably isn't the best option for you. I'm not advocating gun control, or taking away anything like that here. It sounds like hes done his research and has purchased what feels like to be the best option for him.

The other alternatives are valid ones. Houses with alarm systems, or even alarm system signs, are much less likely to be broken into. They also work while you are home and when the house is empty. As for the whole sword bit, I was halfway joking to try and lighten the mood of the thread a bit. In all honestly I would be more afraid, as a home intruder, of someone brandishing a sword than a gun. If you have a sword chances are you will much more willingly swipe and stab at an intruder than you are to pull the trigger of a gun. If I was to die I would much rather be shot and have it happen quickly than be hacked to death and die slowly.

Gman offers very sound neutral advice about the subject despite being a gun lover, don't quite understand why anything that even smells of gunpowder it ends up being 10 pages long in which only a very small amount of the posts are actually useful.

Gman has seriously crossed the line between owning and LOVING guns.

He seems responsible, and I don't begrudge him his hobby. He is kind of a weirdo(about guns), but I don't begrudge his right to own firearms and ammo en masse. Point being I am sure he won't shoot me one day, mistake or purposefully.

I mostly agree with honestly on this subject, and on my own soapbox do not think guns are "defensive."

I love guns, guns are F*CKING fun. Guns also kill people, and need a respect and education to suit their potential.

Folks who scream about guns as an inalienable right need to take a step back. Just saying.

You don't think it's our right to own a gun? Well....you are entitled to your opinion but im sure glad you were not around to write our constitution!

Neither were you, and our forefathers were way too busy fighting tyranny to form an opinion about the long term progression of society and the progression of gun tech.

It's really cute to pretend that George Washington and Thomas Jefferson, et al., could predict the future. But they couldn't, and that's just how it is. We need not pretend the rational judgement of the musket generation applies to thermonuclear weapons and us folk who live in the era.

Guy.....fighting tyranny is what my whole life is all about. And I can tell by this statement what your entire socio-political views are, and have made a promise to gman not to get into any such debates, so Im just going to leave it at that. However I will say this before Im officially done with this thread.....

I can tell just saying the word gun seems to make you upset because your talking points here are very laughable IMO. No sir....mr Washington did not have a crystal ball or predict the future. If you studied anything about the founders you would know they disagreed on almost EVERYTHING.......except the 2nd amendment. They specifically put that in there as a deterrent to any and all forms of tyranny. It is not there for hunting. It is not there for only police and military. It is there for every citizen to use at their discretion. Just because you choose not to exercise this right that people like myself fought in a war for that is your decision. Please do not talk to me about fighting tyranny.....I have spent my whole life fighting tyranny and will do so until I am dead.

Nobody in this thread said anything about owning nukes. A nuke is not a firearm.....it is an explosive..... please do not throw that in there because I don't believe anyone should have nukes, and never claimed such. 2nd states "right to bear arms" referring to firearms AS self-defense. This notion that you do not consider a gun can be used as a defensive tool is totally Ludacris.... did you not read mossy's story? His granddad used a gun to defend himself and stopped an intruder without even fireing a shot. So I would say you were wrong to say that guns cannot be used as a defensive weapon. I can go on all day about the things you are saying but frankly I think I have proven my point and I got other shit to do. This thread has ran its course and everyone has said everything they needed to, but I'm sure you will fire back with more "you don't have a right to such and such nonsense" when in fact, yes sir we do have that right!

I think you're making the mistake thinking being shot also means dying quickly, but it doesn't.

That's some ignorant shit right there.

It saddens me that you actually believe that idiocy.


Oh, and I love how firearms somehow also means nukes as well. What a joke. I can't believe you expect to be taken seriously with such an ridiculous argument.

Lol these posts wouldnt get so long and dramatic if you wouldnt take every single post anyone makes that isnt pro gun as advocting gun control. Honestly and twig literally said nothing about not having the right to own guns but you paranoia conspiracy junkies turn it i to that to avoid any actual debating.

See what I mean, Chris??! LOL - gun nuts just make me laugh, plain and simple. Gman isn't a "gun nut" by the way...he just absolutely loves guns, he isn't ranting and raving about people trying to take his rights away, etc.

This is a pretty stupid standpoint to have. If guns aren't for defense, why do police carry them? Why does the Secret Service carry them? Why do people spend millions of dollars a year on things like personal/home defense gun classes, guns specifically suited for defense, and ammunition specifically designed for personal/home defense?



This is not true, as guns are inanimate objects. This, next bit however...



is very true.



I'll go off on a tangent here and give you a bit of a lesson on the current mindset of the gun-owning individual in the United States right now.

The thing about the second amendment is that it IS an inalienable right along with the other rights protected (and not given to us) by the Bill of Rights. Much like the first or the fourth, people are attacking them on a regular basis. People need to stand up and fight for their rights. I'm not talking about declaring war on the government, but I am talking about getting engaged with your legislators and letting them know what you think.

This isn't really related to this thread, but it'll help you understand why people are so upset about the current state of affairs re: firearms legislation. Things like an "assault weapons" ban or a magazine capacity restriction seem like sensible legislation to those who do not regularly engage in shooting sports, but they aren't sensible at all. The US Supreme Court decisions in DC v Heller and US v Miller upheld that owning firearms is an individual right, and those types of weapons that were in common use were protected under that right. The AR-15 is one of the, if not THE most common rifle platform in the US. It is in common use, and it is protected by the US Constitution. Some legislators (like Feinstein) don't care about passing constitutional laws; they only care about taking away peoples' rights to benefit their own personal agenda. These are the people who should be stopped. If you support guns and are a constituent of one of these types, it is imparative that you let them know how you feel.

Remember the Stop Online Piracy Act? Do you remember the level of outcry it raised from individuals and businesses alike? Those who were upset by that bill were individuals/companies who know the Internet. They know how it works, and they spend a good deal of their time there. Most of the companies that protested generate a great deal of their income from the Internet. People were outraged by it because had it passed, it would have hurt their profitability and been a violation of both the 1st amendment and the 4th amendment -- both rights we have as human beings, protected by the Constitution. That's what's going on in the gun community right now. There are people out to get the second amendment, and often times when someone goes to defend it, they're dismissed as being a crazy person or a gun nut. While there are a lot of stupid pro-gunners, there are also a lot of stupid anti-gunners. It's the nature of the beast, and the beauty of our country: you don't have to be informed/intelligent to have an opinion.

All I ask is that you try to see and understand my side of the argument. I grew up shooting. My dad was a Marine and my mom was a police officer and then a firearms instructor. I grew up deeply ingrained in gun and shooting culture. It's something I care about deeply, and it is an inalienable right.

lolwut? Guns really don't kill people. The only way a gun can kill a person, is if the person using a gun causes it.... That's not the gun, it's the person.

acute lead poisoning amirite?

I don't give a shit about what Commie does in regards to his situation, as long as he does something to protect himself in the future..
Buying a rifle, buying a samurai sword, buying a security system, or all of the above. As long as you aren't totally vulnerable.

The only reason I went on my rage post was because it's annoying how every thread about guns turns into some political bullshit.

Once this semester ends (because ill have more time) I plan on purchasing a rifle. Shooting is probably one of my favorite things to do.
So by all means I am for the right to own a gun.


^ I 100% agree with this statement. I know Gman likes his guns. I also know that if I ask him for help regarding a firearms purchase or whatever the case is that he will give me an answer to the best of his ability without all the extra bullshit.

Can Commie just get like 6 dobermans and we can call this thread a day?

But dobermans can't fire guns. :(

LAWL

I wish every post in gun threads and political threads could be like this one. Well thought out, no hostility, and some solid facts. The threads would go on long enough to actually die on their own. Well done G!