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Hooker
[n00b] Member
Joined: Sun Oct 04, 2009 1:47 pm Posts: 2564
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 Re: Future of gaming
I didn't look into your other points because I didn't really care that much. I wasn't addressing anything other than that last paragraph because you sounded like a jackass. Also: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/3D_scannerImported from real life!
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| Tue Oct 04, 2011 9:43 am |
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airman
[n00b] Member
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 12:21 pm Posts: 316 Location: South Carolina
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 Re: Future of gaming
Lol I was being sarcastic about the File > Import > Real life deal - that was probably the only non-serious and sarcastic thing I talked about. People have been using them to import models into games and stuff for years. I know what a 3d scanner is...lol
I am not a game developer, but I used to want to be so my understanding is there. I'm not a know-it-all, book of knowledge that can explain exactly how to build and render a sparse voxel octree from scratch, but I do have enough to see a lot of the broken pieces of this tech that they are presenting...
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| Tue Oct 04, 2011 9:56 am |
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reezy1
Forum Newbie
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2011 8:10 pm Posts: 33 Location: USA, Midwest
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 Re: Future of gaming
airman wrote: I definitely didn't mean to step on anyone's toes because I've obviously upset some folks. Let me apologize for that first, I'm sorry. I'm just throwing my points out there (without namecalling) from what I've learned from looking into this since I first saw it a while ago and offering my skepticism. To Hooker - ouch dude. I've followed this tech since I first saw it in like 2003....and really nothing new has happened to it. Maybe that's why I'm so indifferent. I'm not saying that one day, this might have some momentum to it. Seriously though, they've been working on it for at least seven years and have yet to do something useful with animation? Shadows? Something please? Lol I'm not saying it's not possible. Of course it is - we see it in the video. And yes, it does look really really good. But honestly though, it's going to be a decade or more before anything useful comes out of it because we simply don't have the means to handle that much data. The entire demo it's just a bunch of instances. It's bunch of objects replicated over and over facing the same direction. You can do amazing things with instancing. That's why it actually runs at 20fps. Also, the entire island surface is completely flat. Did anyone notice that? Lol. I've spent many hours looking at this tech since it resurfaced a few months ago - because it's interesting. But there's just nowhere for it to go right now. Polygons work great. And no, they're not as ugly as you're shown in the video, those are terrible examples. Look at gameplay for BF3...it's stunning. Polygons + tessellation = just as much detail. Let's say on a typical 1920x1080 screen there are roughly 2 million pixels...which is nothing for today's video cards to handle at high framerates. So if I stuck one polygon per pixel on my screen, you wouldn't be able to tell the difference. Polygons aren't the limit...RAM and disk space footprint is. For Euclideon to go anywhere in the game market, they need to be able to demo and optimize: -Realtime shadows -Fluids and particles -Deformations -Skins -Skeletal animation -plenty else. Reezy, I've seen the video. If you're talking about the goofy neon lsd giraffe trippy shit showing collisions and animation, that's from 7 years ago. Why do I look ignorant, lol? I've really taken the time to look into this stuff. Take some time and just browse some developer/coding/game dev forums on the subject and you'll see what I mean... Again, sorry for stepping on toes and farting on others' pillows for stating my skepticism and giving reasons for it LOL. Just browse around their website and see what you'd think if you wanted to take them seriously...I lol'd. http://unlimiteddetailtechnology.com/description.htmlSorry wasn't trying to be a dick or anything, no hard feelings on this end. I understand the video from 7 years is far from impressive, but keep in mind these guys are not artists, they are simply design the project for real graphical & coding artist (idk the real job title) to take and expand into something great. I understand at this moment in time the project can catch a lot of flack for lacking in many areas you have pointed out... animations and things like that. But again they are not artists, they are just laying the ground work for the job. Think of it as a blueprint. Later this can be coupled in with various physics engines and what have you to create a final product. Like i stated before, rome wasn't built in a day, it takes time to revolutionize things, especially things people are already comfortable with. Many people fear change. I dont see why this project is catching so much hate,,, its like people dont want to advance the science behind gaming and graphics and are just content with the somewhat bland worlds that are recreated from game to game. Sure BF3 looks decent, but in taking time to really observe various features, such as the terrain, it is less than stellar (so far; it is only a beta at this point). Lastly that website you posted is not "their" website, it is merely an informational source someone complied. This is their official website... http://www.euclideon.com/
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| Tue Oct 04, 2011 3:49 pm |
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Jet
Game Server Admin
Joined: Sun May 11, 2008 11:00 pm Posts: 840
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 Re: Future of gaming
If you think the technology is real, I suggest you read this paper
Processing and interactive editing of huge point clouds from 3D scanners Main Author: Michael Wanda
You should be able to access it from any university. Basically, it's a paper from 2008 that deals with point cloud data on the scale the euclideon guys are claiming they can do. A 14 million data point set took 6.5 HOURS to render The system they used was Intel Core 2 Duo 6600 (dual core), 2.4 GHz/3GB RAM 2x500GB SATA, raid-1 (mirrored) nVidia GeForce 7900GS
Given this result, I find it impossible to believe that the can be rendering even a million data points in real time.
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| Tue Oct 04, 2011 4:41 pm |
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Gman
[HNIC] Stзamroller ω
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2004 11:00 pm Posts: 13453
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 Re: Future of gaming
_________________ I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me. -- Hunter S Thompson
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| Tue Oct 04, 2011 4:53 pm |
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dirkdeagler
[n00b] Member
Joined: Sun Oct 25, 2009 7:12 pm Posts: 3663 Location: Mt Hood, Oregon
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 Re: Future of gaming
Interesting choice of punctuation-
_________________ BAN Log: Player [[n00b] Reborn''] [STEAM_0:1:456925] Time 02/21/2010 @ 17:17:03
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| Tue Oct 04, 2011 5:04 pm |
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Gman
[HNIC] Stзamroller ω
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2004 11:00 pm Posts: 13453
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 Re: Future of gaming
dirkdeagler wrote: Interesting choice of punctuation- You got a problem with my period? 
_________________ I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me. -- Hunter S Thompson
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| Tue Oct 04, 2011 5:11 pm |
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t0keN
Game Server Admin
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2009 12:00 am Posts: 2738 Location: Jacksonville, NC
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 Re: Future of gaming
That is the worse picture ever haha
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| Tue Oct 04, 2011 5:18 pm |
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airman
[n00b] Member
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 12:21 pm Posts: 316 Location: South Carolina
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 Re: Future of gaming
ROFL at the last few posts
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| Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:00 pm |
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Greatness
Field Nigga
Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2009 12:00 am Posts: 988 Location: Urbana, IL
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 Re: Future of gaming
lol at the last few post and also nothing is impossible we just don't know how to do it yet. First thing they drill into your head at B school is that the answer isn't no we cant do that, the answer is we cant do it that way we need to find another way to reach the end goal. I am a firm believer that this can be applied to any business and any product. I may not know how to do it but if i gather enough talent and get them the funding to focus only on this tech i will build a business that brings you the new wave of gaming tech. Competency traps are the biggest reason we have disruptive innovations that change industries. TI and their processors, is you look at the history of HDs each company that was the leader at one level failed to grow and adapt to where the market was going and was replaced by companies like Euclideon.
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| Wed Oct 05, 2011 12:56 pm |
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Jet
Game Server Admin
Joined: Sun May 11, 2008 11:00 pm Posts: 840
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 Re: Future of gaming
Greatness wrote: lol at the last few post and also nothing is impossible we just don't know how to do it yet. First thing they drill into your head at B school is that the answer isn't no we cant do that, the answer is we cant do it that way we need to find another way to reach the end goal. I am a firm believer that this can be applied to any business and any product. I may not know how to do it but if i gather enough talent and get them the funding to focus only on this tech i will build a business that brings you the new wave of gaming tech. Competency traps are the biggest reason we have disruptive innovations that change industries. TI and their processors, is you look at the history of HDs each company that was the leader at one level failed to grow and adapt to where the market was going and was replaced by companies like Euclideon. I wasn't saying the task they are trying to do is impossible. It's a great approach, but still years ahead of its time. All I was saying is if they are claiming they have the system TODAY, they are full of shit. I have no doubt that eventually someone will figure out how to render and manipulate 3-d point cloud data in real time, however until such a breakthrough is documented in a peer reviewed journal, I would be highly skeptical of any company claiming they can do it.
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| Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:15 pm |
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